Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
11wildy (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Eccentric Rose,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=IoBV3NoH,comment-id=00050001,timestamp=2019-03-29T13:09:41.452+0000) > > Interestingly enough, my Summoner Name - "Eccentric Rose" - and I presume the fact that I'm a dedicated support main, quite often I've had players - on both my team and the enemy team - ask me if I'm a girl. If they do, I usually just say "yeah" or "mhm". > > And admittedly, I have been treated a bit more uniquely because of it. Sometimes my team will say "gj (my champion)"a lot more for doing simpler things. > Other times its for more 'inappropriate' things. I remember a Xayah player once asked me if I was a 'busty girl'. Someone else once asked me how old I was. Usually for those comments, I say "who knows" (maybe that's not the best response, but I think it's ambiguous enough, not too aggressive and I like to be able to communicate with my team and not have to mute them). > > Rest assured that that is **not** the attention I'm seeking. I don't mind people knowing that I'm a girl, but I don't want special attention for being a girl, just general acknowledgement throughout the community that both boys and girls play this game. Then we can surely agree on this. I never thought you were the attention seeking kind of person. I think the behaviour of some people is unacceptable regarding females though. If it bothers you, you could also just add nice players and play with them :). Have you ever had free skins or so, from people trying to hit on you? xD
>Have you ever had free skins or so, from people trying to hit on you? xD Someone once offered to get me a 975RP skin. It's a tempting offer, but I declined, because I didn't want to accept something that wasn't motivated by the greatest intention.
: I think we should just use the language that everyone is used to and not play language police, there is more important stuff. English is just very simple and inaccurate language that changes a lot and there are a lot of overlappings. Guys is used as gender neutral... I guess it could becomes the same for other words. You just gotta go with it. Unless you wanna sound like you are from the last century... then you can say "peeps". xD
Yeah, I can agree on that. I would regard "guys" as being gender neutral, myself. "Peeps" sounds good too (and kinda funny as well) XD
Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Eccentric Rose,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=IoBV3NoH,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-03-29T12:39:17.216+0000) > > With regards to the LoL community and its internet icons: they're mostly male too, but I personally don't see their content as being oriented towards males, just LoL players as a whole. Correct. League of Legends doesn't have a gender targeted audience. Riot wants everyone, even if their audience is mostly male. Same goes for streamers. They don't really care if they have male or female watching. The thing is, because most of their audience tend to be males, they address them as such. It really is just a form of speech. When someone says "gg boys" they're not trying to exclude/ignore females. *** > [{quoted}](name=Eccentric Rose,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=IoBV3NoH,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-03-29T12:39:17.216+0000) > > Now I did generalise a bit. Redmercy often does say "boys and girls" at the start of his videos, but later during them, he will just say "boys". Gbay99 would always say "ladies and gentlemen", the circle of MagikarpUsedFly, Darkk Mane and Bricky usually say "everyone", Anklespankin and Professor Akali always use "guys" > But I would still be willing to get that many of them forget that females are watching them too. I wouldn't say they forget. If you do/say something regularly, you tend to stick with those habits. You need to do the mental effort to do/say something different. They're used to speaking with males, so those expressions just fly right out of their mouths. Words like "dude", "bro" and "man" are common when speaking with other males. I'll use myself as an example. Believe it or not, but sometimes I address my mother as "dude", just out of habit. Do I forget I'm talking with my mother? No, but it just slips out. *** > [{quoted}](name=Eccentric Rose,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=IoBV3NoH,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-03-29T12:39:17.216+0000) > > I'm the embodiment of the e-girl stereotype > I know that other girls don't tend to play other roles. I'm mostly a support main too. I don't play Janna/Soraka specifically, but I play similar champions to them: Zilean, Taric, Rakan. It just so happens I like the supportive role. Females tend to play, and like, the supportive role too, but that doesn't make them "e-girls". The stereotype exists because of something else. That said, plenty of females play roles other than support, just like plenty of males play mostly support. *** > [{quoted}](name=Eccentric Rose,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=IoBV3NoH,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-03-29T12:39:17.216+0000) > > I'm not insisting that LoL girls should get special treatment: just that we're there alongside the boys. Don't worry, you are playing alongside everyone else. The chat example you gave is the perfect example. As soon as you say something like "Only girls?" or "What about girls?", some will correct themselves. *** Honestly, if I were female, I wouldn't want to let other people know. Nowadays it isn't as bad, but there are still some players who are toxic towards females in specific. Also, "revealing" your gender will put you under an amplifying glass. For every little mistake you make you won't hear the end of it. ######There's also the unwanted attention that comes with being female. In a male dominated space, you're bound to have players hitting on/flirting with you. That may, or may not, be something you want. If everyone assumes you're male, you won't get much unwanted attention.
Yeah, I understand. That's the for the insight, I appreciate your opinion.
Fedairkid (EUW)
: I don't think anyone means to be pushing girls away by saying stuff like “gg lads“. It's just that assuming your whole team is male tends to be a safe bet. Personally I use “guys“ most of the time, but have definitely said something like “wp boys“. Not to make you feel unwelcome, it's just correct way more often than not (which is a shame, but whatever). Though, most of the time I just use the gender of the champion when talking about someone. Something like “What is kayle doing“ “She is helping top“ 100% I have addressed loads of boys with “she“ or “her“ that way. I would suggest leaving stuff like “boys??“ as an answer out, nobody means to insult you when saying “gg boys“, and it can come off as “I'm a girl pay attention to me“ or something. You know how quickly a nice game can turn into a toxic mess around here XD. TL;DR: People shouldn't assume everyone in the game is male, but there is no ill-intent behind it.
I understand that, and I get that it's not said with intentional disregard for females, but to me, it still comes across as being excluding. I do think that "guys" is pretty much gender-neutral nowadays though, so I have no problem with that. And I also agree that addressing players by the champions they're playing is the best way of communication. It's how we say "lucian, come help me with drake" or "report xerath. toxic", and from my experience, players tend to use the pronoun of the gender of the champion that players are using. If I'm playing a male champ, I can see that that is the case. It's when I'm playing a female champ and I'm referred to as "he" that I get confused. Whenever I've implicitly said that I'm a girl by saying "boys??" I don't mean it to be toxic or for person attention - far from it. It's me giving a little elbow nudge that there aren't just boys in this community. It may not look like that, but the all the responses to me doing that have never been toxic or heated ones. No one has ever said something like "stfu nobody cares", they always said something like "and girls" or "sorry, forget that girls play this game too XD", which I can appreciate it. >People shouldn't assume everyone in the game is male, but there is no ill-intent behind it. I can take solace in knowing that.
: Simple question: Do you want other players to know that you are a girl? I can tell you the answer, yes you do, because you enjoy the attention, otherwise why would you name yourself "Eccentric Rose"? I also played a lot of enchanter support in the past then people would call me Soraka or she, but that doesn't matter at all, when you only care about the game and not about, other things... I am male. If you think you are not asking for special treatment you are actually lying to yourself, because that is exactly what this is all about. If you only care about the game, then you just play, if you are there to show off your femininity, because, let's be honest, some girls enjoy doing that, then at least admit it and don't act like this is some equality thing. You can be treated like everyone else, but you WANT to be special. In my time playing online games I even learned that some of the girls who try super hard to appear feminine are actually guys who are just roll playing, trolling people, or even trying scam little boys, LMAO. You want to get noticed as a girl and not just be another player, why you do that... I can only speculate. > Us girls are not asking for special treatment distinct from males, just that we're not forgotten about. Ey and don't speak for other girls, speak for yourself. The moment you pretend to be spokesperson for all girl you are actually acting like a feminist and I mean not the kind of feminist that was fighting for important womens right last century, more like the modern ones that are using feminism as a disguise to feed their own narcissism and get privileges/attention. You are not forgotten, you are anonymous, why would you want to give that up? When i get called she I don't feel like telling everyone that I am not a girl, because I don't think it matter for the game, it would only come across as weird or funny when you play something like Sion or Garen, why do you care so much? {{sticker:slayer-jinx-wink}}
>Simple question: Do you want other players to know that you are a girl? I can tell you the answer, yes you do, because you enjoy the attention, otherwise why would you name yourself "Eccentric Rose"? It's a name I came up with **years** ago on Steam. I just like the rose flower. It just happens to sound 'girly': but that was no intentional. I don't want special attention and I'd rather stay anonymous whilst playing, but I don't see why the community should act like girls don't even exist. >I also played a lot of enchanter support in the past then people would call me Soraka or she, but that doesn't matter at all, when you only care about the game and not about, other things... I am male. I still play other male champions as well, and I get referred to as "he", because the majority of players address the champion, not the person behind the keyboard. That's perfectly fine, but I get confused as to why when I play female champions that players will say address me as "he". >If you only care about the game, then you just play, if you are there to show off your femininity, because, let's be honest, some girls enjoy doing that, then at least admit it and don't act like this is some equality thing. You can be treated like everyone else, but you WANT to be special. In my time playing online games I even learned that some of the girls who try super hard to appear feminine are actually guys who are just roll playing, trolling people, or even trying scam little boys, LMAO. You want to get noticed as a girl and not just be another player, why you do that... I can only speculate. **No.** You are assuming aspects about me that I never explicitly stated. I do not care about myself being recognised as a girl whilst playing. I said specifically that I **not** want that. I said that I wanted the community to not assume that all players are male: for all the players to be just people - not boys. >Ey and don't speak for other girls, speak for yourself. The moment you pretend to be spokesperson for all girl you are actually acting like a feminist and I mean not the kind of feminist that was fighting for important womens right last century, more like the modern ones that are using feminism as a disguise to feed their own narcissism and get privileges/attention. Alright, yeah, I shouldn't act as though I'm speaking on behalf of all female players, (although I should point out that some of my friends feel similarly to me) but don't be impetuous and assume that I'm an narcissist. >When i get called she I don't feel like telling everyone that I am not a girl, because I don't think it matter for the game, it would only come across as weird or funny when you play something like Sion or Garen, why do you care so much? If you get called a girl when playing as Garen and Sion, it's likely to be the player making a joke. A Caitlyn or Miss Fortune being player being called a boy is far more likely to be the player reckoning that it's a guy. The discussion probably didn't come off as light when I said that I get "really annoyed" by it, and because there are whole load of 'feminazis" around who give feminism a bad rep. It's not something I feel vociferously about. I'm just don't understand why females in the LoL community seem to be forgotten. I made the discussion to see what other people's thoughts were, not to unleash a diatribe. I'm don't think that girls should be shouted out individually from boys: I think that we should refer to players as "they", "them", "everyone".
: I mean sure, if you want attention you do care about such irrelevant things. Otherwise you just play the game and get addressed as whatever champion your are playing. The reality is, your gender doesn't matter. Most players will only care about how you play.
I'm not talking about the gameplay here: just the way that everyone is addressed. I agree that referring to the player by the champion they're using is perfectly fine and probably the most practical way of communicating in-game. But the assumption of a male gender - from my experience - seems to transcend this idea of just addressing the name of the champion. I'm the stereotypical e-girl support main, and I play a lot of the enchanter supports like {{champion:117}} {{champion:40}} {{champion:267}}, yet my teammates still seem to refer to their support as "he". Us girls are not asking for special treatment distinct from males, just that we're not forgotten about.
SambaHong (EUW)
: I have a little quote from [quora](https://www.quora.com/Is-the-word-guys-gender-neutral-Is-it-appropriate-for-a-male-to-address-a-group-of-women-or-mixed-gender-people-as-guys-as-in-hey-guys-or-refer-to-such-a-group-as-you-guys) that might shed some light on this subject and the use of guys towards both genders.. _People understand "guys" in the second person plural to be gender neutral. Using "hey guys" and "you guys" (or even "guys" as short hand when in the second person) is use to address all men, all women, or mixed-gender groups. There is no issue with using it, therefore._ _However (and I'm guessing this is why you've heard that it's not politically correct), "guys" is not gender neutral in the third person. Just think about how your brain reacts to these statements:_ _"I talked to a few guys at the mothers group."_ _"We need to hire some new guys as nurses."_ _"I saw this one guy driving and she was out of control."_ _Did you hear "guy" as a man? Did you think the sentence looked funny at all? If so, that's because "guys" isn't gender neutral for you in the third person._ _This is why it's not politically correct to say things like:_ _"Have you talked to the IT guys yet?"_ _ "Startups are best with at least two guys involved." _ But I personally do not agree with your premise that forcing others to type or speak in a certain way is necessary at all. Online personalities means no disrespect towards their female audience when using "boys" or "lads" .
I probably should've made it clearer, but I personally see "guys" as being gender-neutral. It might technically speaking still denote males, but its common usage has morphed it into term to mean everyone. >But I personally do not agree with your premise that forcing others to type or speak in a certain way is necessary at all. Online personalities means no disrespect towards their female audience when using "boys" or "lads" . It might not be showing intentional disrespect, but it is showing negligence and a failure to recognise that they have a female audience, and it can certainly feel like it from our perspective. "boys" and "lads" just feels excluding.
Murdarici (EUNE)
: It's just a habit of speech, "wp guys" fit better because it feed all gender, non genders, animals, and aliens, flowers, plants and hannah montana fans don't forget the new trend is to not address to somebody cause they get offended if you assume a gender, cause now is: she, he, their (not for plural but for Non-binary) so wp boys, wp girl, wp somebody that's is all and nothing, wp aliens, wp animals, wp plants, wp amoebas, wp flat earthers {{sticker:zombie-brand-facepalm}}
"Guys" I consider to be gender-neutral nowadays (even if it strictly speaking refers to males) so I don't have a problem with it. But I still think that terms "everyone" or "people" are perfectly natural and encompass everyone.
: Personally I always try to refer to people as them/they/theirs until I'm informed otherwise, or until I hear someone else that knows them use their pronouns. Or by the champion they're playing if we're referring to the plays etc (e.g. Elise would be "she" and Ryze would be "he") etc. I dislike the idea of misgendering someone (seriously, as much as it seems to reach joke status with most people on the internet which is a whole different issue, it's not nice. Imagine being addressed as the wrong gender your whole life - this is why it's not funny).
Yeah, those are my sentiments exactly. I always use them/they/theirs as an undetermined pronoun or just refer to the champion as the basis for the gender, which extends to any reports I make.
: Tbh never seen that hapen my teammates always write as you said gg wp or gg gj or smt like that and i usually say gj guys but if i would be in you're situation i would probably feel the same
It's far removed from being the biggest issue in the world. It's just something I've noticed recently and thought that I'd make this discussion to see what other people have to say. "Guys" I see as being more gender-neutral in this day and age, so I don't have a problem with that.
chεf (EUW)
: The community is heavily dominated by males so it would make sense. If im in a group of guys and one girl and say "good job guys" i dont really see the problem as im still adressing that they did a good job.
Whilst "guys" strictly speaking refers to males, I see it as being more gender-neutral nowadays and is used to encompass pretty much everyone , so I don't have a problem that. It's the terms like "boys", "lads" and "men" that get me frustrated when they're used for male exclusivity in LoL.
Akorahil (EUW)
: I never thought about it this way. I always say "wp Team" (for a feeling of solidarity) Would you consider "gj Mate" also as gender neutral or not? (90% of the time i play with my GF)
It still has male connotations, but I think that "mate" is pretty much gender-neutral nowadays. My girl friends often say "mate" to each other as well, so I don't have a problem with that term.
11wildy (EUW)
: This sure is an interesting topic. There's plenty of females playing league, but you are right that they often are not mentioned as such. On the other hand, if people find out you are a girl, do they act differently towards you? I am genuinely curious about this!
Interestingly enough, my Summoner Name - "Eccentric Rose" - and I presume the fact that I'm a dedicated support main, quite often I've had players - on both my team and the enemy team - ask me if I'm a girl. If they do, I usually just say "yeah" or "mhm". And admittedly, I have been treated a bit more uniquely because of it. Sometimes my team will say "gj (my champion)"a lot more for doing simpler things. Other times its for more 'inappropriate' things. I remember a Xayah player once asked me if I was a 'busty girl'. Someone else once asked me how old I was. Usually for those comments, I say "who knows" (maybe that's not the best response, but I think it's ambiguous enough, not too aggressive and I like to be able to communicate with my team and not have to mute them). Rest assured that that is **not** the attention I'm seeking. I don't mind people knowing that I'm a girl, but I don't want special attention for being a girl, just general acknowledgement throughout the community that both boys and girls play this game.
kiwishrew (EUW)
: Guy here. It's just a superficial form of camaraderie, and shouldn't be taken so personally. The reality is that males make up the vast majority of the community, and streamers recognise this. So to make the majority of their fanbase feel included and good, they use endearing terminology to address them. It makes the majority of their fans (boys, men, guys, whatever you want to call us) feel more involved and included, and therefore subconsciously more likely to stick around and keep watching. It's unfortunate but incidental that female viewers may feel left out as a result. But in the end, you've got to look at it objectively; it's not a sleight against women, and it's not favouritism for men. It's just a streamer unconsiously exploiting his audience so he can keep paying the bills and buying expensive toys for his room. Edit: In public games, allchat, real-life etc, I definitely agree that we could afford to be more inclusive in our wording of phrases
I understand the reality there - it makes sense. I do enjoy these streamers/YouTubers enough that I won't turn away from them just because they haven't seemingly addressed their female viewers, but I do kinda wish someone could give them an small elbow-budge, just as a reminder that it's not just males watching them, ya know?
: I am a girl and I don't give a %%% about what someone has to say, unless if he is about to flame or insult. He can say boys, lads, dogs or cats, I don't mind it.
That's perfectly fine. I'm just curious what other girls/boys think.
Smerk (EUW)
: Personally I use words "guys" and "dude" if I want to say something to many or one person respectively. I consider those words to be gender-neutral and I don't really care if someone thinks otherwise
Nowadays I would probably consider them to be gender neutral as well. (Maybe not so much dude, but it's close enough).
: i'm a girl and i always say stuff like 'gg boys' 'wp lads' just because i can
gg girl (That's fine. I was just curious other people felt. I could even in the minority of girls for all I know)
Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Eccentric Rose,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=IoBV3NoH,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-03-29T00:20:47.951+0000) > > I'm probably being too much of a feminist here - I admit that - but it really annoys me when the League community seems to assume that everyone playing the game is male. I wouldn't call that being a "feminist". You're just seeing the whole picture. I'll ask you this: if you had to guess a ratio, how much of League's population is male? 50%? 70%? More? We just assume the other players are male because most of the community is exactly that: male. Besides, "gg boys" is just an expression. Would you rather read "gg people" or "gg humans", to be more "inclusive"? *** > [{quoted}](name=Eccentric Rose,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=IoBV3NoH,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-03-29T00:20:47.951+0000) > > Could League internet personalities just say "guys" As in the point above, the people watching those streamers are usually... you guessed it: male. *** Now let me throw a wrench in how you see the world. I watch cooking shows often. The ladies in those cooking shows address their audience as "women" and "ladies". Should I bother about it because they don't use a gender-neutral noun? How dare they assume the people watching them are all female? The reason is simple: that's their target audience. I said cooking shows, but I could have said... I don't... makeup tutorials: [James Charles](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZLW23rwPDw). Why does he say "Hello sisters" instead of something neutral? Because that's his target audience: female. *** > [{quoted}](name=Eccentric Rose,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=IoBV3NoH,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-03-29T00:20:47.951+0000) > > Whenever someone in the chat refers to boys or males in the chat, I usually type "boys???" To me, everyone is male unless I know who you are. If you said "boys???" I would simply ignore you. *** > [{quoted}](name=Eccentric Rose,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=IoBV3NoH,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-03-29T00:20:47.951+0000) > > or am I just being too sensitive? Probably too sensitive. There are better things to be worried about, such as _**[this comment was removed to be compliant with Article 13]**_
> I'll ask you this: if you had to guess a ratio, how much of League's population is male? 50%? 70%? More? > > We just assume the other players are male because most of the community is exactly that: male. Besides, "gg boys" is just an expression. Would you rather read "gg people" or "gg humans", to be more "inclusive"? > I'm well aware that the LoL community is predominantly male - absolutely, but that doesn't meant it's completely devoid of females though. Plenty of Riot staff are female and I play with other girls as well as boys. Personally, I would say that something like "gg people" or "wp everyone" sounds and reads perfectly natural. I usually say "wp everyone" myself - although that's probably just the way I am. > As in the point above, the people watching those streamers are usually... you guessed it: male. > > Now let me throw a wrench in how you see the world. > I watch cooking shows often. The ladies in those cooking shows address their audience as "women" and "ladies". Should I bother about it because they don't use a gender-neutral noun? How dare they assume the people watching them are all female? The reason is simple: that's their target audience. > > I said cooking shows, but I could have said... I don't... makeup tutorials: [James Charles](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZLW23rwPDw). Why does he say "Hello sisters" instead of something neutral? Because that's his target audience: female. Products and services have target demographics, I get that. Please don't think for a second that I am not aware that many things are being catered towards **both** men or women specifically. Cooking shows and makeup tutorials as you mentioned, books, games - everything is engineered for an intended audience. With your example of cooking shows: I watch them too, and I don't agree with the hosts assuming that all the viewers are female. There's nothing I can do about it, but I can still be mildly irritated by it. With regards to the LoL community and its internet icons: they're mostly male too, but I personally don't see their content as being oriented towards males, just LoL players as a whole. Again, maybe that's just my perspective, since I'm a female watching their content alongside the males, but to me they seem very gender neutral. Even when they address their audience as male, it doesn't make me want to stop watching them, because I enjoy their content and see it as gender neutral, hence why I don't see an excuse to forget that female viewers are watching their videos too. Now I did generalise a bit. Redmercy often does say "boys and girls" at the start of his videos, but later during them, he will just say "boys". Gbay99 would always say "ladies and gentlemen", the circle of MagikarpUsedFly, Darkk Mane and Bricky usually say "everyone", Anklespankin and Professor Akali always use "guys" But I would still be willing to get that many of them forget that females are watching them too. Furthermore, I know that LoL has been marketed mainly towards males pretty much since the beginning. The style of game play along with abundance of sexualised champions and skins tell you that much (I personally don't have a problem with that), but there's plenty of content for girls to love too. We have champs like {{champion:81}} {{champion:126}} {{champion:517}} as our equivalent to the guys' {{champion:21}} {{champion:103}} {{champion:421}} I'm the embodiment of the e-girl stereotype: support main who loves champions like {{champion:117}} {{champion:40}} {{champion:267}}, (but I've recently been trying out other aggressive supports like {{champion:412}} {{champion:555}}, and I really enjoy them), and I know that other girls don't tend to play other roles. And can you really tell me that newer champions like {{champion:142}} and {{champion:518}} were made to appeal to a male playerbase? > To me, everyone is male unless I know who you are. If you said "boys???" I would simply ignore you. To be fair, I do make assume that too a lot of the time, because I know that most LoL players are male. But I still don't think that in-game we should talk as if that is actually the case. I'm not insisting that LoL girls should get special treatment: just that we're there alongside the boys.
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Eccentric Rose

Level 264 (EUW)
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