: still belive that M7 shows skill that's why a lot of M7 yasuo feed M7 means nothing. Most of challenger people dont have not even 1 M7 champ, not cause they are bad just cause their games are a stomp of 30/1 like bronze and silver games. I think the 4 downvotes on your post show how much community agree with you
M7 should represent skill potential, which it does. This does not include your in-game decision making capacity and mechanical skill or knowledge all together. That I'm afraid is your misconception not the mastery depiction.
: >I'm not talking about playing a Kayle that was carried and won, I'm talking Kayle that carries. Obviously that how you get mastery tokens no? I got some kayle support token and didn't needed carry the game.
Your consolation argument I'm sorry to say is trash, Hypercarries should get recognition through filling their role and should supports. Don't make like Kayle is okay, because you received a token supporting [While I received mine carrying, however need to work 10 times harder to do it now] because it's not okay.
L0513N70 (EUW)
: Most challenger players also how numerous accounts, which others don't put the effort into doing. How much of the community are Kayle mains or people who know what they're talking about? These are the distinguishing factors, I mean who wants to deal with another Hypercarry like Kayle straight after her release? Who wasn't crying when Kayle single handedly changed the direction of the match, Kayle mains of which there are few as is.
LOL you played a hypercarry as support (You silver 3 even in Bronze I can out play in your elo) and telling the hypercarry mains that they shouldn't be upset. GG. Play Yasuo or Darius or maybe Nasus as support whithout being called a troll.
: >I'm not talking about playing a Kayle that was carried and won, I'm talking Kayle that carries. Obviously that how you get mastery tokens no? I got some kayle support token and didn't needed carry the game.
LOL you played a hypercarry as support and telling the hypercarry mains that they shouldn't be upset. GG. Play Yasuo or Darius or maybe Nasus as support whithout being called a troll.
: still belive that M7 shows skill that's why a lot of M7 yasuo feed M7 means nothing. Most of challenger people dont have not even 1 M7 champ, not cause they are bad just cause their games are a stomp of 30/1 like bronze and silver games. I think the 4 downvotes on your post show how much community agree with you
Most challenger players also how numerous accounts, which others don't put the effort into doing. How much of the community are Kayle mains or people who know what they're talking about? These are the distinguishing factors, I mean who wants to deal with another Hypercarry like Kayle straight after her release? Who wasn't crying when Kayle single handedly changed the direction of the match, Kayle mains of which there are few as is.
: i didnt say that nothing you say doesn't matter. I just say that you arent looking at high elo people. Game is balanced arround high elo, if high elo is playing fine like 52% winrate is unlikely that riot will buff kayle.
I'm not talking about playing a Kayle that was carried and won, I'm talking Kayle that carries. Obviously that how you get mastery tokens no? These are different arguments altogether anyway this high elo argument to me is irrelevant because I know I'm Bronze but literally outplayed silvers especially of late. Point is as a dps champ Kayles trash Yasuo is less trash, thats it.
: sry but kyle dont have same skill cap that yasuo yasuo have 8 games on challenger (56.33% winrate) while kayle 2 (100% winrate) even lol client says that Kayle 2 of 3, yasuo 3 of 3
LOL dude exactly what you presenting is why you shouldn't be talking, also your source of information is questionable. I doubt you're even within a capacity to be talking numbers. Longer story short, you really don't know what you're talking about. However let me know when you hit M7.
: sorry but your experience is a bronze experience dont take it bad, but you dont know a lot of game.
Lol thats like saying someone's ignorant because of skin color. Your assumption technically says because I'm in Bronze nothing I say matter, I'm incapable and equally presented the opportunity as you to have gotten to a higher elo? Better check yourself.
: yasuo have 48.4% winrate on plat +
There's more than plat - does Kayle get played in challenger? No. Why's Yasuos win rate bad because be strategically kill him or he isn't played well. Kayle however right after and sometime after being reworked went from too strong to reasonably strong to nothing. Why though? Because she's a high skill cap champ that if addressed in the same way Yasuo is?
: M7 means nothing and kayle have 52% winrate on plat + so she isnt so bad like you said bad is yummi with 45.57%
Yuumi is classifieds a hypercarry too - great. What's Yasuos Winrate? also How big is the sample of this 52% win rate? sitdown dude I'm talking from experience. unless you a Kayle main you should sit down.
L0513N70 (EUW)
: Now get it. Then tell me that
I've seen 60k+ Yasuos not so with Kayle though - They're both Hypercarries though. You scared she'll kite you to death? 1v5 & struggle to kill her?
: M7 means nothing and kayle have 52% winrate on plat + so she isnt so bad like you said bad is yummi with 45.57%
Now get it. Then tell me that
: Is this a troll? She was buffed twice in the last 2 patches.
> [{quoted}](name=Space Jhin,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=lyv9qMax,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-09-16T23:00:29.102+0000) > > Is this a troll? She was buffed twice in the last 2 patches. Are you M7 Kayle, Have mained her? When you play Kayle in high elo do you feel like she develops smoothly? No one plays Kayle for a reason. People are finding new mains for a reason.
Rioter Comments
: Your name suits you well. She's MUCH better than she used to be lol
Not actually I've mained Kayle too, her previous mechanics were better. Yasuo couldnt wind wall her damage, she could ult while doing stacked splash damage. She had no skill shots but you needed patience in approaching a fight, even if you could win. Now you win in farm maybe in kills too and you don't have basic attack damage to get you through even after 20 minutes. You literally still need to hit 11 before gaining relevance, I mean she was strong when released but now AGAIN nerfed to ****. If she's meant to be strong make a damn strong, I look at Yasuos passive and how broken that is for a hypercarry, but when Kayle takes Yasuos position EVERYONE cries crocodile tears. THAT defeats the purpose, within that case Kayle shouldn't be classified as hypercarry but rather as the peoples choice.
Rioter Comments
PhaPhaHD (EUW)
: There was a problem selecting your champion
> [{quoted}](name=PhaPhaHD,realm=EUW,application-id=eZuvYsEr,discussion-id=YrX4x6u3,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-08T16:21:12.987+0000) > > everytime i try to pick an champion i get the message there was a problem selecting your champion and now i got an 30 minute ban i cant play any game cuz everytime i try to pick an champ this comes > can anyone help me? I've also been getting major lags when going into ranked matches specifically where it'll literally take 10 seconds for my ban selection to scroll, if I'm lucky. Otherwise I can't ban anyone, that being said play Kayle with a hard counter being Nasus, I can't even ban him then I'm in a loss onslaught to this popular pick. It's been happening for ages, however it REALLY annoying.
: > What juggernaut has the same range as Jayce? {{champion:266}} {{champion:31}} {{champion:36}} {{champion:420}} {{champion:75}} {{champion:2}} {{champion:6}} {{champion:83}} > You comparing his E to Darius is a bit off maybe by about 2 lengths. Longer range but more delayed and easier to dodge... it also doesn’t have a 99% slow attached to it And more comparing the passives, both give the same amount of % pen > Darius is easier yo kill than Mordekaiser early game Darius is more likely to kill but also more likely to die (balance). Even a full combo doesn't do as much damage as Mordekaiser. That’s not true in the slightest. Morde has a lot less damage in all of his abilities... his Q is as damaging as Darius Q, Darius has stronger auto attacks, stronger passive, a W with damage, and an ult with damage. His survivability also has a shorter cooldown and isn’t reliant on being charged up first so he always has it. The only difference is that you’ve learnt how to play vs Darius you haven’t yet vs morde. > Comparing reworks on the basis of vulnerability makes sense. The was a time Kayle could be 1/12 and still scale successfully she can't now. Mordekaiser will always have the scaling opportunity because of his ult. Except they are different champions, you don’t compare theme because they aren’t comparitable. Kayle is a hyper carry marksman, morde is a mid to late game juggernaut... you’d do better to compare to nasus than you’d ever get to kayle. Morde shouldn’t have the same vulnerabilities as kayle period.
You also seem mistaken the above champs have a single skill which is ranged technically speaking Morde has 2 with mid ranged passive.
HeresyHorus (EUNE)
: {{champion:164}} {{champion:114}} {{champion:126}} {{champion:64}} {{champion:236}} {{champion:133}} {{champion:91}} {{champion:6}} All those can easily eat 3rd of your HP at lvl2, more reliably than morde and lot of them can even do HALF ur hp or more lvl2 if they combo correctly like {{champion:133}} {{champion:91}} {{champion:64}} {{champion:126}} {{champion:6}}
I wasn't talking level 2, I scaled pass level 5 or 6 farming and dodging. Jayce would also have equal chance in winning a lane against any the above with the lack or durability and high damage output.
Hexa XV (EUW)
: > Then Bam he hits me with 1 combo (E, Q, W) and my HP is a third Like you said, he used his combo... If it was velkoz he would have killed you with 1 combo easly. Like probably more champions with a good damage. Also I played against Morde many times and I didn't saw that he is OP. His ultimate seems amazing but after few times I finally realized what to do (usually used zhonya to just wait it out or used my combo inside his ult). I wouldn't say he is broken. I much more feel annoyed with Nocturne lately.
If I close engage Velkoz with Jayce I generally win. Which means trade off to Vels high damage is low armor and health, not to mention the lack of sustain and durability.
: > [{quoted}](name=L0513N70,realm=EUW,application-id=39gqIYVI,discussion-id=5qIE46AK,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2019-06-22T10:43:50.821+0000) > > Not to mention the Magic pen that E gives, also all you talking about is a successful laning phase. I'm saying I didn't do badly 1 mistake caught out just costed way too much. Not doing badly isn't enough vs a champ like Morde. That's like complaining you lost to Nasus while you "didn't do badly". You need to be stomping those kind of matchups early, while they are vulnerable. Going even or slightly ahead isn't enough vs a scaling champ like that.
Nah Nasus stacks take a while more than Morde scaling to reach out of control. He literally owns game with 2 cheap items then can choose either tank OR blistering hard AP or magic pen. Show me Darius scaling in line with majority of the enemy team outscaling them with only 2 items.
: Mordekaiser has his vulnerabilities. He has very high cooldowns early on (24seconds on E 14 seconds on W shield 8 seconds on Q) and doesn't buy alot CDR in his current meta build. he is very immobile and easy to kite his whole ult can be rendered useless by the press of a button. He loses to alot of hardcore earlygame toplaners like Darius Renekton and Jayce consistently by not being able to outdamage them or getting kited hard. The only thing that can be annoying is his shield but you can play arround that.
You realize has to be immobile because of his E? Even its reach is ridiculous its virtually an adcs reach on a juggernaut. With the damage passive of Mundo W fully empowers, its more like clutches of no return. Even Darius kit is not as comprehensive in killing until 6 without outscaling.
: Mordekaiser has his vulnerabilities. He has very high cooldowns early on (24seconds on E 14 seconds on W shield 8 seconds on Q) and doesn't buy alot CDR in his current meta build. he is very immobile and easy to kite his whole ult can be rendered useless by the press of a button. He loses to alot of hardcore earlygame toplaners like Darius Renekton and Jayce consistently by not being able to outdamage them or getting kited hard. The only thing that can be annoying is his shield but you can play arround that.
Jayce? Have you played this match up? Have you been E'd while kiting? This match up is the very reason I'm posting. Jayce about the same range as Mordekaiser but is Sooooo much more squishy with an E,Q stopped by minons and melee form even with additional mr and armor STILL melts in close to mid range battle. Keep in mind even though Jayce hammer form E knocks Morde back once Morde has crystal scepter or even prior even changing stances doesnt give enough ms to get out of his passive.
: > name a Juggernaut who is as dominating early game? Even Nasus is more vulnerable than Mordekaiser, Most juggernauts are dominant early game, morde is actually pretty weak early he’s got no damage in his kit for the first few levels (remember his on hit has no base value) and his cooldowns are stupidly long > I'm saying for Mordes kit there is too much damage for the amount of resistance and cc he has He’s got less damage than Darius, less durability as Darius, and the same amount of cc. > How do people forget that his E does almost an items worth of magic pen? Which is the exact same as Darius > all his damage is exaggerated who cares if theirs only 2 attacks. Cause early game it severely weakens him, that’s his main weakness is his reliance on 2 abilities. And again his damage is less than other juggernauts, his cc is the same or less than other juggernauts, his cc is more counterable than other juggernauts, he’s squishier than other juggernauts. There’s no point comparing him to kayle they are worlds apart, but compared to any other juggernaut he’s fine... hell even comparing reworks this is smoother than the juggernaut update
What juggernaut has the same range as Jayce? You comparing his E to Darius is a bit off maybe by about 2 lengths. Darius is easier yo kill than Mordekaiser early game Darius is more likely to kill but also more likely to die (balance). Even a full combo doesn't do as much damage as Mordekaiser. Comparing reworks on the basis of vulnerability makes sense. The was a time Kayle could be 1/12 and still scale successfully she can't now. Mordekaiser will always have the scaling opportunity because of his ult.
: Remember he’s a juggernaut... he’s honestly not as tanky as other juggernauts (a single shield rather than constant healing) and he’s not as damaging either (only 2 damaging abilities, Q and passive, and his autos are still weaker than theirs as they are ad). So he shouldn’t be made less damaging or more vunerable, your comparing essentially an adc in kayle against a juggernaut.
I'm comparing reworks, name a Juggernaut who is as dominating early game? Even Nasus is more vulnerable than Mordekaiser, I'm saying for Mordes kit there is too much damage for the amount of resistance and cc he has. How do people forget that his E does almost an items worth of magic pen? all his damage is exaggerated who cares if theirs only 2 attacks. I'm not talking theoretically, this dude is really out of balance.
: Learn to play vs Morde. His early cooldowns are very long. Every time he misses his E, trade with all you've got. Only his Q and passive do damage. Make the trade short and disengage when his passive activates. You need to stomp him hard enough early so he can't just R and kill you when he hits 6. You also need to have enough items to beat him when he finishes his Rylai's, because after that you're not getting away from him.
Not to mention the Magic pen that E gives, also all you talking about is a successful laning phase. I'm saying I didn't do badly 1 mistake caught out just costed way too much.
: He has two skill shots and no mobility. If you cant outplay him, its you not him.
If I put you in a room filled with poison with a 30% chance of escaping, if you die - Its on you not the situation. Also who needs mobility when you have a massive shield, tankiness and reach? what do expect him to be a god before getting nerfed? If Garen had his kit he'd become a damn hypercarry.
Hexa XV (EUW)
: > Then Bam he hits me with 1 combo (E, Q, W) and my HP is a third Like you said, he used his combo... If it was velkoz he would have killed you with 1 combo easly. Like probably more champions with a good damage. Also I played against Morde many times and I didn't saw that he is OP. His ultimate seems amazing but after few times I finally realized what to do (usually used zhonya to just wait it out or used my combo inside his ult). I wouldn't say he is broken. I much more feel annoyed with Nocturne lately.
Name a good damage champ that at the same level does a third damage with 2 abilities?
Wex0r (EUW)
: i like how you had to search in bronze 2 to find this smurf. Ranked Solo Bronze 2 88 LP / 12W 7L Win Ratio 63% Find this in diamond or higher then maybe he needs a nerf
Sure If league only made for higher tier players. I mean lower tiers don't earn Riot a significant amount of commission and popularity only higher tiers do.
Wex0r (EUW)
: He is fine people just need time to adapt to his new abilities.
If you saying he's fine it needs to be based on something, what is it? I'm saying leave him as is and reduce his damage OR leave he's damage and make him more vulnerable. Have you ever noticed how easy it is to kill Kayle without her ult? Or when she hit 2.5 attack speed in like 20 minutes or kill people mid game with one combo? Even that was more vulnerable than this.
: he isn't difficult to play stay within minions and run sideways always his q and e are hard to hit on oponents with more than 370ms if you do get hit disengage unless you can fight him melee champs with sustain tanks swain does fairly well too into him not every champion is supposed to do well into every champion some have rough matchups doesn't mean the champs are broken that said morde is pretty strong nerfs to his auto ap contribution and tick rate of his passive might be good
I beat Morde with Kayle, point isn't that I can beat him. The point is he has too little vulnerabilies, I main Kayle when Kayle was reworked I carried entire matches alone. This would be the case here (now I've got even limited early game items to play with). However you cant compare his ability range to any other Melee champions, his passive is absolutely too strong (Its like a 5 point Mundo W), his wave clear excellent, Engage and counter are insanely good when played well enough, He lacks in sustain, but with correct runes and his W he becomes virtually unkillable early game especially. Plus he's so tanky sustain should be a luxury. I killed him with Jayce But at the cost of my laning and late game phases, I'm pretty sure the amount of champions that play into and lose are far more than not.
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L0513N70

Level 147 (EUW)
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