JesRect (EUW)
: Can Riot please help players understand this complicated game?????
In the turtorial we only learn about the goal of the game (destroy towers, destroy nexus) and how it works. But theres no turtorial for teaching itemizing, objectives like drake + baron, jungling? Pros/contra of pushing/freezing lane. Players are just thrown into this game and dont even know that theres more to learn. How can they improve like that? This is bad and lazy to be honest
: Who should i play (fast paced)
{{champion:64}} {{champion:126}}
Silisa (EUNE)
: You clearly haven't played Soraka enough. Soraka has decent poke and can be quite oppressive in hands of a true main. She, however, gets heavily out damaged by actual poke supports like Zyra, Karma, Vel'Koz, Brand, Zilean, etc. In these lanes, she can only survive by - you guessed it - out-sustaining the enemy. So putting her in a neat box labeled "poke supports" is ridiculous. Against kill lanes, a heavy damage poke support like Zyra can, even though she lacks mobility and reliable disengage, win a lane against a heavy engage support by forcing her enemy out of lane and keeping them too low on hp to start a fight. Unlike Zyra, Soraka does not have the kind of damage that would force the enemy support to play passively. Yet again, she proves that she cannot be labeled as a poke support. Soraka is, at her core, a true sustain support, which goes against your theory. The only support triangle is kill - sustain - poke. This triangle is based on the core traits of supports, not their possible play styles. Maokai is mostly played as a kill lane - an engager. However, he also has pretty god-like disengage and I often pick him into other kill lanes. As a support Maokai, depending on the situation I can play engage, disengage and even poke lanes. All three are my chosen play styles and do not change the fact that Maokai is a kill lane support. A Nami support can focus on sustain against a heavy poke opponent, choosing to use her Ws to keep her carry and herself alive, because her player decided the the large mana costs of her W are better used for survival. A more aggressive Nami player could decide to use her Qs to engage against a poke support and win the lane by killing the opponent. Notice how neither of these would make sense if we were to classify Nami as a purely disengage support. A Bard support can focus on poking; or he can run with Electrocute+Ignite, focus on landing his Q and creating kill threats in lane. In the second case, Bard, even though a poke support, is played with a kill lane play style. A Janna, who you classified as a disengage support, can, if played properly, be used as both poke and engage support. By creating these unnecessary labels, all you are doing is creating limitations and causing confusion for new players.
> She, however, gets heavily out damaged by actual poke supports like Zyra, Karma, Vel'Koz, Brand, Zilean, etc. In these lanes, she can only survive by - you guessed it - out-sustaining the enemy. So putting her in a neat box labeled "poke supports" is ridiculous. I happen to play Soraka alot. I played her maxing Q or W and even max E. I tried out many different Styles. Soraka provides the most Sustain of all Champions and thats part of her unique Identity, granted, But just because she is designed as the Champion with the most Sustain, doesnt mean that her existence is the reason to add "sustain" as a winning strategy and play style. It just means that she is the Champion with the most Sustain, point. If you look closer at it, you will notice that It even proves my theory right, because Riot couldnt just leave her as a Utility/Sustain Champion alone. She needed abilities that ties to the Engage, Disengage, Poke Triangle. Riot can never release a Champion that is only providing Utility and Sustain. It wont work in this Game and its not designed for it. now lets go even deeper in her basic ability Q: Her Q is so underrated. People only see her initial damage of 230 magic damage with an ap scaling of 35% on level 5. However, they always forget that it is on a static 5 seconds Cooldown from level 1 on. It is also easy to land because of the large AoE and doesnt collide with minions. She also heals herself with it and slows enemies. Of course it will have a little less Damage because of the Utility it provides but its NOT as low as people think. Lets compare this to Velkoz Q. It is on a static Cooldown of 7 seconds and does an Initial damage of 240 magic damage and has a AP scaling of 80% on level 5. It collides with minions and is harder to land, but it has an increased Range. His Q can hit multiple enemies and has a slow component just like Soraka's Q. Conclusion: Where Soraka has an added sustain (and ms) component. Velkoz has more Range and slightly more damage. Why slightly you ask? Lets see how much damage Soraka and Velkoz Q does in 10 seconds. She does 460 magic damage with an AP scaling of 70% in 10 seconds. Velkoz does 329 magic damage with an AP scaling of 114% in 10 seconds. This means that Soraka does more damage in early game and laningphase as Velkoz but looses against Velkoz the more AP they both gain. This is just fair because Velkoz doesnt provide as much Utility and Sustain as Soraka does. But she isnt a bad Poke champion as many Players see her. She also isnt a Sustain only Champion.
NoobStory (EUW)
: You explained how Rakan is a disengage support by describing him doing exactly what an engage support does: go in, cc, get the kill A disengage support would be something like janna who can negate a go in (alistar w for example) with her q or r, she has no means to go in and hard cc like rakan does. And even though rakan is quite squishy, when he goes in with r+flash+w, there's not much you can do to react, especially if he's followed by his mates, he'll q and e back to the carries. You're not afraid of Rakan protecting his carry, because a Lulu/Janna/Nami or even Thresh are much better at this than him, but rather afraid of him bumping a few of your carries and destroying the teamfight with a terrifying engage.
> You explained how Rakan is a disengage support by describing him doing exactly what an engage support does: go in, cc, get the kill No. I gave a perfect example of how he is effectly disengaging. Stop mixing things up.
NoobStory (EUW)
: To put alistar/rakan in disengage and thresh in engage feels somewhat wrong x) Same with describing Quinn as an adc, she will usually get stomped in 2v2 (bot) And it doesn't seem quite accurate to replace sustain with disengage. It's really hard to play vs nami as an ap support (like zyra), not because she prevents you from engaging, but because she negates your damages with her sustain. It's the same with soraka and sona, and karma to some extent: their most fearsome aspect is that they negate your damage, through heals or shields. That's why I believe the kill>poke>sustain>kill is much more true than your disengage>engage>poke>disengage.
I will give you an Example of Rakans Disengage Potential: Nautilus engages Xayah with his Q. Rakan shields Xayah with his E and reduces further damage. Lucian dashes forward. Rakan follows up with his W and disrupts both Lucian and Nautilus in their Attempt to go All-in. Nautilus activates his shield and Riptide to slow Xayah down. Rakan uses his Q on Nautlius. Nautilus autoattacks Xayah to lock her down. Rakan uses his E again and shields Xayah and heals her immidiatly with Q's aftereffect. Nautilus and lucian use their Ultimate on Xayah. Rakan and Xayah use also their Ultimates. Xayah gets untargetable and negates Nautlus Ult. Rakan charms both Nautlus and Lucian and interrupts Lucians Ult. Xayah uses her Combos and goes for a Double kill.
Rioter Comments

Qronics

Level 61 (EUW)
Lifetime Upvotes
Create a Discussion