Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=0003000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-16T17:23:04.008+0000) > > But the guy playing teemo didn't get unbanned even if he didn't troll, he was just trying to win. [Nubrac](https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=nubrac) was unbanned. Well, he served his 14 day ban like everyone else with that punishment. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=0003000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-16T17:23:04.008+0000) > > Also NB3 has been banned just because they got exposed/he kept flaming (but I'm not sure since he flames 24/7 and he can still stream). I don't like NB3. Streamers are held to a different standard, truth be told. They have more leeway in some of the stuff they do. Still, as long as they leave the flame out of the chat (like Tyler1 and Trick2g) they can flame all they want to the camera. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=0003000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-16T17:23:04.008+0000) > > Also I don't think you can call anger a mental disorder or something related to the animals. Anger is anger and you can't be sure to control it. I'm not saying anger itself is a disorder. The disorder manifests itself as anger. There's one called Intermittent Explosive Disorder (IED). Constant/consistent outbursts of anger **is** a mental disorder. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=0003000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-16T17:23:04.008+0000) > > Imagine giving ur best to win the game but someone tried harder to grief it. At the end of the game you get banned for flaming and he doesn't. And you can't even surrend nor ask to surrend or you will be banned for negative attitude. Is it fair? Yes, it is. You're judged based on **your** actions, not based on what triggered them. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=0003000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-16T17:23:04.008+0000) > > I think that all the people praising permaban didn't get that the point is that these people can make another account and come back to flame and nothing changed. Here's what you don't understand about the system. Most permanently suspended players don't come back. Heck, most players won't even go past chat restrictions. Those that do either genuinely try to improve their behaviour or are the **really** toxic players. The latter are a minority within a minority. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=0003000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-16T17:23:04.008+0000) > > Basically, the permaban is just a risk for the players who are not used to flame but does it accidentaly in some circustances and gets banned You're being disingenuous. No one flames "accidentally". Also, you won't be perma-banned for one offense. You need to actively pursue toxic behaviour to get there. If it was me, after the 14-day suspension I'd stop using chat all together.
>Nubrac was unbanned. Well, he served his 14 day ban like everyone else with that punishment. Ye he spent his 14 days ban without any reason, just because nb3 had a riot friend. Also his account is now signed and if he gets banned again for any other reason he might get perma. Fair uh? Also a lot of streamers flames in the chat not just verbally on the stream, just to clarify. >Imagine giving ur best to win the game but someone tried harder to grief it. At the end of the game you get banned for flaming and he doesn't. And you can't even surrend nor ask to surrend or you will be banned for negative attitude. Is it fair? Still what about the other one not being banned? He has been such a nice person. This happens just because most of the reports are managed by bots who doesn't do their work well. They don't want to waste time and employes on managing these cases and the court system who existed is the proof. >You're being disingenuous. No one flames "accidentally". Also, you won't be perma-banned for one offense. You need to actively pursue toxic behaviour to get there. If it was me, after the 14-day suspension I'd stop using chat all together. Ye this is exactly what I did when I had my 14 days ban the first time but 1 year after I wrote something bad again for like 2 games and I got banned. Because IT HAPPENS, it can happen at a certain point for so many reason. You can't call this a disorder. After 1 year of grinding and being nice. Really deserved. While people who flamed me in everygame where happily playing. The permaban just made the "I don't care, it's not my main" players exist.
: Will i ever get unbanned?
I just wrote a post about the ban system and apparently the community doesn't care about that. They just want you out even if you flamed just few times and get banned for it. I've been downvoted aswel so rioter will never read my post. This is so sad. The community thinks that the permanent ban can solve the toxicity but they can't admit that it is not working and that they are just punishing these cases, in which in my opinion, people should get more chances. They said that if I can't control my instinct I'm basically an animal.
Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-07-16T16:28:07.291+0000) > > And if you look at the thing that way, Tyler1 didn't deserve to get unbanned. He wasn't. All his banned **accounts** are still banned. Tyler was ID banned which is very different from a normal ban. Why should he be treated any different for being a public figure? Every other player can just make a new account and play there, so why should he be any different. Is for that reason why Riot lifted the ID ban. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-07-16T16:28:07.291+0000) > > And what about Nightblue who had a rioter ban the guy playing teemo with literally no reasons attached to the ban report? Is this what you call fair? No, it isn't fair and NB3 was banned one week later for 14 days. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-07-16T16:28:07.291+0000) > > People are different. If all the people where like you there wouldn't be accident, mistakes and other bad things that may happen during your life. You can't always control your instinct I don't want everyone to be **exactly** like me. Clones aren't necessary. What I want is for everyone to **behave** similarly to me. I'm not asking for much. Just behave like a decent human being and keep your emotions in check. Everyone can learn discipline. Irrational animals act on instinct and we are not like them. We are capable of suppressing our urges, some more than others. Problem is some of us chose not to and, instead, let our emotions control us. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-07-16T16:28:07.291+0000) > > you can't say that these person are not normal, or you will say that something like 90% of the population is crazy. There is a Youtuber/Streamer that I used to follow that sometimes can't stop himself Technically speaking, people with mental disorders aren't "normal". It's called a disorder for a reason. Most people are "normal" though. Those like me only need to try a bit more to be like that, but it isn't impossible. Why do you think anger management is a popular topic? We know the disorder is treatable and we treat it as such.
>No, it isn't fair and NB3 was banned one week later for 14 days. But the guy playing teemo didn't get unbanned even if he didn't troll, he was just trying to win. Also NB3 has been banned just because they got exposed/he kept flaming (but I'm not sure since he flames 24/7 and he can still stream). Also I don't think you can call anger a mental disorder or something related to the animals. Anger is anger and you can't be sure to control it. Imagine giving ur best to win the game but someone tried harder to grief it. At the end of the game you get banned for flaming and he doesn't. And you can't even surrend nor ask to surrend or you will be banned for negative attitude. Is it fair? Also I add something in the original post. Even if the permaban exists, the community is still a lot toxic. Isn't that because the permaban is completely useless and this is not the best way to manage toxicity? Like I wrote, if you give a candy to a kid but then you take it back and even eat it so he can't get it anymore, it will just be way more mad at you (please take that example just like what it is, don't compare kids to all the league players). I think that all the people praising permaban didn't get that the point is that these people can make another account and come back to flame and nothing changed. They just lost their money and that made them way more mad (look how Tfue didn't want to buy cosmetics on the new account). Just not to make the discussion longer, since this post about a serious question has been downvoted a lot because people thinks that what they say is gold (Riot will never read this post now), this is the point of my entire monologue. Basically, the permaban is just a risk for the players who are not used to flame but does it accidentaly in some circustances and gets banned, but it doesn't solve the toxicity that you can taste in that community in every game. Thanks for giving me your attention. EDIT: One guy just posted about is permaban for basically being impulsive so a human, not an animal.
Febos (EUW)
: You mentioned your discussion, so I'm going to answer here. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-16T14:27:22.693+0000) > > Since I think that the permaban is not fair because people invests a lot of money in that game Doesn't matter. First off, you don't "invest" anything. You **give** your money away. Think of it like a donation. You give Riot money to support them. An investment implies you'll get some value out of it in the future for yourself, but that won't happen. The only "value" you get out of it is your own enjoyment. Also, why is it unfair? I'd find it more unfair if people with money to waste would be immune to punishments. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-16T14:27:22.693+0000) > > Well I want to start saying that even 1 year ban is a lot for a player and a permaban should not be needed. You're right. For a normal player, a permanent ban shouldn't be needed and most of us will never get close to it. However, those who receive permanent suspensions are not "normal" players. Those are the kind of people we want out of **our** game. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-16T14:27:22.693+0000) > > but what about just keep banning that player if he keeps being toxic? Banning them for 1 month few times and then go with 2 months or more should be a good solution. No. Riot is very lenient on their punishment system. I would give you one, and only **one**, chance to improve your behaviour. Riot gives us more than one chance. In the worst case, exactly one. If the player doesn't improve his behaviour after the 14-day suspension, then that player shouldn't be playing this game. Escalating bans by 1 month would only postpone the inevitable. 1 month, 2 months, 3 months, ... 2 years... When does it stop? Besides, by the time someone gets to 2 months they already have a 2nd account they can play in while they wait for their main to be unbanned. It would never stop. At least, right now, once permanent suspended there's no going back. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=gnt1QFe0,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-16T14:27:22.693+0000) > > P.S. Also being able to fully disable the chat can be a nice idea for impulsive/toxic players It takes, at least, two key presses to say something in chat; one to open it and one to send the message. Before you press the enter key again, you have time to reconsider what you just wrote. Besides, in most cases, you won't be punished for one game and only one sentenced. You will be punished if you **consistently** display toxic behaviour over a course of a few games. That's not impulsivity. That's a pattern. I'm somewhat impulsive, but being like this doesn't mean you can't control your actions. For example, the other day I was about to break a glass for no apparent reason. Literally picked up a glass and a sudden urge to smash it came over me. That is what impulsion looks like. I was able to control it though. If I can control my anger IRL, why can't those players control their emotions in a video game? They're not trying hard enough.
> You mentioned your discussion, so I'm going to answer here. Thanks for reading first of all. >Doesn't matter. First off, you don't "invest" anything. You give your money away. Think of it like a donation. You give Riot money to support them. An investment implies you'll get some value out of it in the future for yourself, but that won't happen. The only "value" you get out of it is your own enjoyment. Also, why is it unfair? I'd find it more unfair if people with money to waste would be immune to punishments. I just used the wrong word. And it is unfair because people like the game and buy things even if they don't have to so even if they are toxic and not that nice with the other players you should not get his account forever. You are not commiting a crime, you are just being less nice and you should get something like house arrest, if you got the comparison. >You're right. For a normal player, a permanent ban shouldn't be needed and most of us will never get close to it. However, those who receive permanent suspensions are not "normal" players. Those are the kind of people we want out of our game. Well I've been banned 2 times for 14 days and the first time was more then one year ago and in my opinion not that deserved (not fully but I can pass it). The second time was few months ago and it was deserved. But it happaned for me to flame just 2 times, for these 6 games who gave me the bans. But in the ban report, the system said that I received 13 reports in 20 games, so even in the game that I hard carried without writing literally anything, just because people where mad at me (I was playing jungle and people gets mad at you if you dont get the chance to gank them most of the times). What about all the times I've been nice and the rest of the team was harrassing me and didn't get banned? This is what I call unfair. And if you look at the thing that way, Tyler1 didn't deserve to get unbanned. And what about Nightblue who had a rioter ban the guy playing teemo with literally no reasons attached to the ban report? Is this what you call fair? At this point everyone should get a chance to get unbanned, even if they are not famous and streamers and get the same chance to get someone banned as the streamers. >No. Riot is very lenient on their punishment system. I would give you one, and only one, chance to improve your behaviour. Riot gives us more than one chance. In the worst case, exactly one. If the player doesn't improve his behaviour after the 14-day suspension, then that player shouldn't be playing this game. Escalating bans by 1 month would only postpone the inevitable. 1 month, 2 months, 3 months, ... 2 years... When does it stop? Besides, by the time someone gets to 2 months they already have a 2nd account they can play in while they wait for their main to be unbanned. It would never stop. At least, right now, once permanent suspended there's no going back. This just ends with him getting 10 accounts banned and no chance to play the same, even without the permaban but at least not giving him the chance to say that the system has been unfair giving him the permaban, since he had MORE then 2 chances to be positive. And no, it is not that lenient. >It takes, at least, two key presses to say something in chat; one to open it and one to send the message. Before you press the enter key again, you have time to reconsider what you just wrote. Besides, in most cases, you won't be punished for one game and only one sentenced. You will be punished if you consistently display toxic behaviour over a course of a few games. That's not impulsivity. That's a pattern. I'm somewhat impulsive, but being like this doesn't mean you can't control your actions. For example, the other day I was about to break a glass for no apparent reason. Literally picked up a glass and a sudden urge to smash it came over me. That is what impulsion looks like. I was able to control it though. If I can control my anger IRL, why can't those players control their emotions in a video game? They're not trying hard enough. People are different. If all the people where like you there wouldn't be accident, mistakes and other bad things that may happen during your life. You can't always control your instinct and you can't say that these person are not normal, or you will say that something like 90% of the population is crazy. There is a Youtuber/Streamer that I used to follow that sometimes can't stop himself, sometimes he can and I think this is completely normal. Hope that you can understand what I wrote and sorry for my english if I made any mistake, also thanks for giving me some of your time to write a decent answer.
Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=2BfrHbKG,discussion-id=QnyRh1xQ,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-16T15:14:32.268+0000) > > We can praise what deserves to be praised. That doesn't happen as regularly as complaints. Almost as if there is more to complain than there is to praise which, in my opinion, is wrong. *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=2BfrHbKG,discussion-id=QnyRh1xQ,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-16T15:14:32.268+0000) > > People complain about specific things that doesn't work that well in the game. Players complain about many things, many of which are just wrong. When was the last time you saw someone saying "Mordekaiser is totally fine"? Or what about other aspects of the game, like when Ardent Censer meta was a thing and you'd see plenty of people jumping on the same train, even those usually in favour of Riot? There are as many "fanboys" (praise Riot for everything) as there are "haters" (hate Riot for everything). Both of those are less than those who are neutral (like me). *** > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=2BfrHbKG,discussion-id=QnyRh1xQ,comment-id=0001000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-16T15:14:32.268+0000) > > it's our and their interest to improve him giving suggestions and discussing about it. Sure it is. You won't get much negative feedback on a proper suggestion. If you spent more time on the boards, you'd know most of the discussions are about [Player Behaviour](http://boards.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behaviour-en). Either directly there or in the wrong board (but still PB content). And what do we see most in PB? Uncalled for complaints. *** [This discussion](https://boards.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/community-creations-en/e8gyBNPt-dear-riot-its-been-4-years) is in Hot. Do you see the OP praising Riot? No. The OP is asking for something. He received positive feedback from us, with just 3 downvotes. [Another one](https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/general-discussion/aNQ1yhvt-prestige-edition-skins-are). This one is calling Riot out on their Prestige money milking thing. What happens when someone "defends" Riot in this instance? This (click the comment): > [{quoted}](name=ThatShinyPiplup,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=aNQ1yhvt,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-07-15T20:39:04.755+0000) > > If you don't like it, don't buy it. Guess how much the skins existing hurts you? 0. As you can see, many players won't blindly defend Riot.
None said that all the comments are useless. I just wrote a post few hours ago about the ban system and the only comments I had was "Well these are the rules and you have to respect them", just like I was complaining about me being banned (I didn't even). I just wanted to talk about the ban system but people have no arguments, they just defend Riot. Also I was talking about posts who talks about the game itself, not about secondary things like skins and other cosmetics who are part of the business of the company. Of course you don't have to buy them to play the game so you don't need to complain.
Tarolock (EUNE)
: >Well but at this point nothing should change if you just keep banning them instead of permabanning. if the result is the same anyway then what is better: banning the guy every single month or do it only once and be done with it? cos im pretty sure the second one is the better >If I will ever get permabanned I will never play the game again since I wasted money on the first one and almost 4 years and this is the point. thats the whole point, if you are toxic then riot dont want anything from you anymore, because toxic players are driving away the normal ones
Like I said in the previous answer it ain't ur job to ban them every month, you dont need to get stressed about it. The ban days can even be incremental so if someone gets banned for three times (for 1 month), the duration can increase to 1 year or 6 months like I wrote in the post. Also the last thing you said it's not true or Riot would ban players by IP. It's just the faster way to get rid of someone not considering what each single person gave to you. Let's not forget that a lot of competitive players are toxic asf and riot doesn't ban them. Guess why
Tarolock (EUNE)
: >Banning them for 1 month few times and then go with 2 months or more should be a good solution. whats the point in banning them for 1 month and after the play 2 games when the ban is over to ban them again for 1 month? why dont you just ban them forever and the problem is solved... >Also for the people who talks about being toxic in different ways you should split the punishment: chat restricted if he flames (can be checked with the bot), 1 month (indicative) ban if he ints or even not being able to ping if he spams them to harrass players (or allow him to ping just once instead of 6). again, why go the long way of letting them ruin more games instead of just permabanning them for being toxic? >Let's be honest, pings in soloq are mostly used to flame and harrass someone when he misplays. yup, toxic kids use it for that, i use it to warn my team... so ban the toxic kids and let me ping missing enemy/warded areas/etc >P.S. Also being able to fully disable the chat can be a nice idea for impulsive/toxic players, if you know what I mean. the chat is disabled by default, you have to hit Enter to chat...
What does it change to you if they ban every month? You are not the one who needs to do the job. This may even allow them to be less lenient and ban more often the players who deserves it and at the same time let them decide if they wants to keep being banned or keep playing. People sometimes impulsive write something even if they are usually calm and you can't deny that nor prove the opposite. If that happens, if they go mad for 1 minute, they just press enter and write whatever they are thinking in that moment. Don't think selfishly. Trolls and toxic players annoy everyone but the permaban is not the best solution when the ban system itself is not that fair. I just got harrased for 3 consecutives games without replying a couple of days ago and none of them as been banned even after the ticket (I checked their match history), so you can't even prove that the system is fair (By harrassed I mean that they wrote words and things that are usually heavly punished, but just when it comes to you)
Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Sanã,realm=EUW,application-id=2BfrHbKG,discussion-id=QnyRh1xQ,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-07-16T14:59:52.364+0000) > > Well but if you ignore that line and read the rest, he's right. No, he isn't. There's about an equal amount of people "attacking" Riot versus those "defending" them. Both those groups are minorities, mind you. What do you see most on the boards? Players making discussions to complain. You don't see many discussion praising them. As contrast, you see a lot of comments "defending" Riot on the former discussions. Go to reddit and twitch. The paradigm is different there. *** Players, like me, "defend" Riot because we're not blinded by anger. We can see the bigger picture. I know what Riot do well and what they don't. I'm one of the first to complain about abhorrent anti-customer practices (eg Little Legends gambling system). Likewise, I won't shy away of saying "good job" when they do something right. I ask again: how many times do you see discussions praising Riot?
We can praise what deserves to be praised. People complain about specific things that doesn't work that well in the game. It isn't perfect and it's our and their interest to improve him giving suggestions and discussing about it. There is no need to praise them for things that doesn't work perfectly. People shows them that they like the good things they do buying and playing the game for hours. And this can't prevent us from talking about our experience and what we think about it.
Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=Luther King Jr V,realm=EUW,application-id=2BfrHbKG,discussion-id=QnyRh1xQ,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-16T14:48:36.002+0000) > > i see 0 reasons to love this shitty company what do you see that i don't? Spoken like someone completely oblivious to reality. Riot Games is one of the best companies in the industry, customer wise. Perfect? Not even close. Shitty? Go drink some milk.
Well but if you ignore that line and read the rest, he's right. People don't even read what you write. Most of the comments have no arguments.
Pxerkza (EUNE)
: more than 14 day bans usually meant that people abandon their accounts and either make another one or quit the game riot wants to give you incentive to not make more accounts and not quit the game they want you to be a good boi and be nice to people the fact that you can't be means that you aren't valuable anymore to riot and thus they perma you if you like the game still you will just create a new account anyway but as trends go if you get permad once you will get permad again so longer punishments don't tend to work
Well but at this point nothing should change if you just keep banning them instead of permabanning. If I will ever get permabanned I will never play the game again since I wasted money on the first one and almost 4 years and this is the point. Since people makes new account, does it make sense to permaban the old one? Just ban them for more than 14 days.
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Sanã

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