: So you are saying he should have been allowed to tell someone to kill themselves?
Chat is chat, games have survived for a long time and been very enjoyable without a system banning players for simply chat. You should ban for explots/extremely bad behaviour, like games have historically done. The mute button exists, it's said before but it's a pretty good argument, you don't have to read chat. Bar extremely hateful chat it should not be punishable. When I talk to my friends who play other online games like CSGO, they find it hilarious and also warped you can actually get banned for chat, it's part of online gaming.
: He didn't follow the rules so he got punished. He probably has had already previous punishments if he got a perma so he has been warned about this behavior before.
The question is though, why are the rules this way. It would be possible to police the game properly, take context into account and address the cause of problems, but it's expensive. It's better to have no justice than extremely poor justice.
: 1. let's be honest, how often does this actually happen? 90% of the time when a pre-picked champion is banned out it's because they don't want that champion on their team. Nothing more, nothing less. 2. How do you know it's the first time they have played that new champion? Anyone can make an account on the PBE to test new champions, and tons of people have multiple live accounts. I'd like to remind everyone reading this that LoL is a TEAM GAME, and if you can't work as a team in the pick/ban phase then you have no chance of working as a team in game. If you ban out someone else's champion for bullshit reasons like this, chances are they are either going to troll you or at the very least be so angry that they will probably tilt and lose you the match anyway. And there's the irony. You banning your teammate's champion to increase your chances of winning is the thing that is likely to lose you the match.
1. It happens a lot. 2. If that's enough to tilt you then you are probably going to tilt over something else anyway. At the end of the day there are 120+ champions in league, if you go into a game with the mindset that you are going to play that champ or troll then you will likely have a bad attitude regardless. On top of that, a restriction on a minimum of x games played in normal or 3v3 games before you can ranked would be great tbh, some people do practice a release champ before taking it ranked, most people don't though.
Gayvin (EUW)
: Banning pre-picked champions
I think it's perfectly acceptable for two reasons. might not be first pick and they don't want to lane vs that champ. 2. You might be trying to pick a brand new champ like Sylas. I played 4 games the other day vs sylas and the players were awful, people should not be allowed to play a champ in ranked without at least 5 normal games on that champ. The fact you can literally purchase a champion and insta queue a ranked game 1 minute later is a joke.
: Chat mutes: The way to spread toxicity
Dude I just got permabanned for arguing with people who AFK'd the game. One was a fiora and irelia who flamed me then went afk at 8 mins while stating they won't play because I didn't gank enough. The other was anivia who refused to play because our support ganked his lane too much and he lost CS. Both afk, both report me, I get perma. Welcome back to league.
: > I heard it's enough that you're teammates false report you a lot to get you banned. Whoever told you that has absolutely no clue what he is talking about. That is not at all how it works. The number of reports you receive doesn't mean shit. What matter is if you actually misbehave or not. If you do, just one report is already enough (more reports are never required, because one report already triggers an investigation, more reports don't change anything). If you are innocent, you can get a million reports and absolutely nothing will happen. So as long as you behave, absolutely nothing can happen to you, no matter what. > Btw is there any way to drop a punishment after a certain time? So you don't get perma banned 3 months after your 14 day ban is over or something. Yes, but it takes a very long time that can very well be considered as "forever". No one knows exact numbers (which isn't possible anyway, because it's not a matter of time but a matter of games played and behavior shown in those games), but it can easily take way longer than a year. If you want to stay on the safe side, you might want to deal with the fact that you can never break the rules again without getting permabanned.
I got a 10 game cr then 25 game cr on my other account, about hmm, 60 games later or maybe 80, I have recieved another 10 game chat restriction. so it reset within that period.
: > [{quoted}](name=gordza,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=ckhEGeoH,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-12-22T17:08:49.843+0000) > > But people such as yourself are not worth debating with Mmhmm, that didn't sound pretentious at all, and definitely doesn't give away the idea that you only opened this thread for pity and agreement rather than honesty and clarification. :kappa: > if you are just going to spew stuff like "it just means that enough people were compelled to click a button" then why can the report system not be treated the same, Because it already operates on the idea that it only leads to a punishment if someone actually did anything wrong. Never mind how this doesn't disprove what I said about the honor system, so nice job shifting the topic unnecessarily there.
>Mmhmm, that didn't sound pretentious at all, and definitely doesn't give away the idea that you only opened this thread for pity and agreement rather than honesty and clarification. When you completely dismiss anything that opposes your opinion as irrelevant when it holds extreme relevance to the topic in question, it isn't pretentious, it's a very valid criticism to your reasoning. You should take all things into consideration and not just what you want to. It's very easy to think one thing if you choose to dismiss anything that puts a flaw in your argument. > Because it already operates on the idea that it only leads to a punishment if someone actually did anything wrong. Never mind how this doesn't disprove what I said about the honor system, so nice job shifting the topic unnecessarily there. The report system does lead to occasions where most people don't think anyone did anything wrong. I got a 14 day ban a couple of weeks ago which many people said was unjust. The fact is, dismissing positive behavior as "oh people just clicked a button" is just an anal way of arguing. They obviously honored me because they thought I was good to play with, yet the people who afk'd the game didn't. That's why the system is completely broken. You are trying to defend an automated system that completely ignores context and allows toxic players to abuse it. In the real world people who's credibility is extremely questionable would not have any sort of evidence granted time in say, a court room, yet Riot allow completely toxic people to spam reports because it costs money to actually implement a system that targets toxic individuals. The people who literally said in chat "ok I will afk" and then proceed to do so won't be picked up by the system, but people who say "why are you trolling" will be.
: Dont use chat.But even if you don't use it you might get ban.Trust me i know. Btw do not hope for any help here.This is the place where trolls spawn. And as someone wrote riot ban ''system'' is a joke.What can you expect from money grabbing ''ladies of the night'' company.
Unfortunately I think this is the way forward, if someone can flame me, afk the game then report me and I get a suspension, what's the point? It's better just to play in silence, it's a shame Riot don't either put resources into a proper reporting system or not bother at all. I would rather play with more inters and flamers than feel like I am not allowed to question people behaving badly, it just means no way in hell am I putting any money into this game.
: > [{quoted}](name=gordza,realm=EUW,application-id=NzaqEm3e,discussion-id=ckhEGeoH,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-12-22T13:26:27.270+0000) > > So all these chats are in response to people flaming me and calling me trash. And the best thing to do would've been to mute, carry on, and report after the match, not make it worse by retaliating and blaming your teammates. > The report system is 100% broken, I only get reported by people who afk games and are toxic yet it results in suspensions? Weird, it's almost like you actually did something wrong or something. > I have a 25 game chat restriction for nothing. You started off trying to be civil, but then degraded into angrily blasting your teammates. Sure, it's a _mild_ form of flaming, but that doesn't make it ok, as the fact that this is a mere chat restriction should indicate. > The first game I was honoured by two teammates for actually trying to win and encourage the flamers to play, who then reported me This means nothing. Honor doesn't mean that you actually _did_ behave well in everyone's eyes, it just means that enough people were compelled to click a button.
All I did was respond to Irelia, I didn't blame anyone except our Zyra, and that was in response to her first saying "I dont care anymore" and then running into and inting their midlaner. The fact i was honoured by the non trolls does mean something, it means I tried to encourage the losing players to play and win the game, and it means that people who play LoL reasonably and don't try to int games thought I was a good team mate, trying to dismisss this just makes it look like you have an opinion and will omit anything that contradicts it to confirm your bias. But people such as yourself are not worth debating with, if you are just going to spew stuff like "it just means that enough people were compelled to click a button" then why can the report system not be treated the same, "the fact you were reported doesn't mean anything, it just means someone was compelled to click a button". See what I did there?
: Bruv league is literally one of the few games that bans for "flame" ahah riot games is a joke of a company
But the thing is I wasn't flaming. Riot has literally came up with their own definition of flame to justify bans because it's cheaper than actually putting manpower in to it. I had a 14 day ban on another account 11 days ago, when asked for a quote in my text as to what was considered flame, they told me and i quote: > > m0usy (Riot Games Player Support) > > Dec 12, 10:29 AM PST > > Hello gordza, > > m0usy here at your service! > > I'm sorry to hear about your recent experience in game that lead to your suspension. I understand things can get heated fast sometimes and this punishment might seem confusing, but after taking a look over your chat log, I can confirm it was rightfully placed. > > **Please note that flaming in LoL can also mean engaging in arguments by spamming the chat** and, as a result, distracting your play mates. No one likes to bear witness to others' bickering and your actions built up to a negative experience for everyone else in your game. So they banned me for flaming, I asked for a quote as to where I was flaming and they then completely changed stance and said I was talking too much. You can't just redefine words to favour your argument mid conversation and this is what Riot did to me. This is just outright lazyness from Riot, the fact I put them in a corner and they then changed reason is just really low.
Hansiman (EUW)
: I'd rather have you open a new thread if you wish to discuss a personal penalty, since this deviates a bit too much from what this topic is about. I'll be happy to answer your questions if you so wish.
So I have just left a new post on my new 25 chat ban. Can you please look at it and tell me why I deserve a chat restriction?
: Hey dude they put a chat in the game but they don't want you to use it they think is for knowing each other or something and not to talk about the game itself ahah disgusting riot games
Its ridiculous, I got honoured 2x by my teammates in two of the games I listed because I tried winning and stopping the people initially flaming, yet people who literally afk'd the games report me and the autoban system says I am in the wrong. League would be better without the ban system than how it currently is.
Rioter Comments
Hansiman (EUW)
: The penalty systems are already designed based on majority opinion from the community.
You think the majority of people would prefer chat scanners over actual real people reviewing games? The problem with Riot's ban system is it's overly reliant on chat, Riot clearly don't want to spend resources on actually eliminating the cause of toxicity in their game, and simply had out bans for the repurcussions of it. If Riot spent more resources on actually weeding out toxic players you would see far less toxicity in the game. Instead it simply scans chat logs for keywords and hands out bans, while allowing the cause of toxicity to go on playing. The fact is 1 player can say almost nothing in chat, purposefully refuse to participate in a game in order to intentionally lose, and Riot will go and ban people who dare say anything bad to this one individual. Riot is banning people for being human while allowing griefers to go on playing, because that's the cheapest way to look like they are combating the problem. Find me one poll that shows people are happy Riot spends more resources combating profanity than griefing and I will believe you, otherwise what you said is not factual at all. There is no justice system in the world that ignores context, yet Riot decides to do this because it costs money not to. Riot should either bring back the tribunal with the ability to watch games live or not bother with a report system at all. It's better to do nothing than do something half assed.
Hansiman (EUW)
: Generally, the system is fair and equal to everyone. But show me a single justice system in the world that can boast a 100% accuracy at all times. No such system exists. > The system is flawed and majority of the people here on the boards agree that RIOT should fix it. "Flawed" is an overstatement. It does what it's supposed to do quite accurately. And I highly doubt you can claim that the majority of people agree with you on that. --- > But RIOT doesn't care about who gets banned right now, they profit from people making new accounts. That's just a wild claim from your part. Riot would much rather have offending players stop offending, and become sportsmanlike. Permabans are a **last** resort given to players that have shown no indication that they want to play by the rules. The players cause other players, that play by the rules, to quite, which ultimately hurts business. Not banning them is much worse for business. If you're permabanned, you're free to leave and not come back. If you can't behave civil towards others, we don't really need you here.
> That's just a wild claim from your part. Riot would much rather have offending players stop offending, and become sportsmanlike. Permabans are a last resort given to players that have shown no indication that they want to play by the rules. Can you please look at my post about my 14 day ban. The Fiddlesticks who started the game calling me a troll for being 40 seconds late to invade, and then proceeded to int the game by standing at hi s turret flaming our adc is still playing. The Fiddlestick is still playing ranked games right now despite inting a game and flaming, he then reported me and I I have a 14 day ban for questioning why he was behaving like this. If Riot does not have the time or resources to properly and fairly regulate the communities behavior - don't do it at all. Read the below, consider he is still playing and I have a 14 day ban, and tell me your system is not broken. In-Game gordza: ? how am i trolling, im here at camp spawn gordza: so you think its good to leave me low hp on a weak early jungler? gordza: and im the troll? gordza: why every time do people take ap bot and behave like this gordza: ?? gordza: why did you not go in gordza: i pinged gordza: you have full hp gordza: no it wasnt gordza: fiddle im just going to mute you gordza: why are you not going in gordza: look their hp gordza: fiddle just sat at turret? gordza: you want to lose on purpose? jesus whats the matter with you gordza: ww gordza: blue gordza: he is just sat at the turret flaming gordza: i tried ganking twice and he just sits there typing... gordza: just mute him i did when i said gordza: really gordza: you going to steal jungle mobs now? gordza: what the hell is your problem man gordza: why are you intentionally losing the game gordza: that cost me lvl 6 gordza: pleease report fiddle gordza: he just intentionally stole jungle mobs from me gordza: fiddle really why did you take my mobs? gordza: why take my mobs man? gordza: you cost me lvl 6 gordza: now i dont have ult gordza: w wq gordza: when they at our turret gordza: fiddle you inted this game gordza: how can you dare blame annyone else gordza: you lost on purpose gordza: thresh u didnt see this guy gordza: he took mobs from me on purpose so i didnt get lvl 6 just now gordza: and is just sat at turrrret b4 flaming, i pinged loads b4 gank and he sat at turret gordza: he is pure toxic gordza: sorry syndra gordza: i tried gordza: he doesnt want to win gordza: im not lying gordza: and everyone can report me, i did nothing wrong so im not scared gordza: everyone report me and fiddle gordza: np gordza: report me and fiddle ty gordza: ill get a review and no punishment gordza: why will anyone else get a ban gordza: gg Post-Game gordza: fiddle reported gordza: KAI gordza: you shouldnt type what you did in chat gordza: now he will report you gordza: and you will get a ban like him gordza: he is going to report anyone, he is toxic, you need to be careful what you type even if he was trolling gordza: enjoy your ban fiddle gordza: what for gordza: i did nothing gordza: you can report me gordza: it will just devalue the worth of your future reports gordza: i said no expletives gordza: no caps gordza: nothing gordza: report me gordza: im fine. gordza: thanks for ruining my game gordza: for no reason gordza: then report me gordza: no problem gordza: im not KAI gordza: i think you are confused gordza: with who flamed gordza: hey LB gordza: please report him gordza: you can report me too its fine i didnt flame or do anything etc gordza: but it will decrease the chance of you running into him again
: The thing you have to worry about is also the Honor now HE was probably banned no joke there, riot actually takes people who intentionally ruin ranked experience seriosly, unfortunately such reports only get there depending on reports the person already has or taken on that match, consider yourself lucky because for some reason 95% of my enemy teams don't report the inters or report at all which is negative because in the past we actually had tribunal to chill and make things a little better , i took got my rewards taken after actually getting into an argument with someone who flamed me on my 1st death when i was 2/0 midlane yasuo saying " typical yasuo spam" and stuff but that's riot for you, in other words, talk only when necessary or just say once in /all chat to report X for Y Sadly i think there could be the new report system and the tribunal maybe with some goodies for those who cooperate to make a game better or getting a key with every report an ISSUE was actually detected P.S.: 14 day ban for that if that's the only reason i am sure RIOT will do something about it, its excessive and unnecessary, the honor lost + 14 days is just a throw off for anyone who didnt do anything that bad or IMO not even close to wrong
I spoke with support who said it was because I flamed. They then retracted this when pressed about where I flamed and said it was due to negativityand arguing, but if I want anything else answered please ask them. When I asked them to review the game log and see I muted fiddle after he started trolling so not to argue with him, they replied with a copy pasta and saying any further replies will be ignored. I find it shocking that they changed the reason for giving the ban after being questioned on their original reason and then proceeded to say they would answer any questions, only to say the very next email they won't reply again. The fact that someone who intentionally lost a ranked match and actually flamed is still playing shows the system is completely broken.
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